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It’s been awhile since we’ve checked in with Ellis Washington, internet radio personality and former law clerk, so I think you’ve had plenty of time to heal.  And we’re in luck, because Clerk Washington (Ret.) is fresh from the gymnasium, flushed, dewy, and as naked as the Truth!

Symposium: Art, music and the Wagnerian dilemma

Socrates (470-399 B.C.) was a famous Greek philosopher from Athens who taught Plato, and Plato taught Aristotle, and Aristotle taught Alexander the Great.

And someone has finally taught Ellis how to use Wikipedia.

Socrates used a method of teaching by asking questions. The Greeks called this form “dialectic” – starting from a thesis or question, then discussing ideas and moving back and forth between points of view to determine how well ideas stand up to critical review, with the ultimate principle of the dialogue being Veritas– Truth.

Which, by a strange coincidence, happens to be Ellis’ gimmick too, “Veritas,” being a word he blurts with the regularity of a wacky sitcom neighbor popping in to deliver his rib-tickling catchphrase.

Characters

  • Socrates
  • Richard Wagner, German Romantic composer
  • Leni Riefenstahl, Hitler’s filmmaker
  • Wimsatt & Beardsley, The New Criticism School
  • Ezra Pound, American expatriate poet
  • Publius, Pupil of Socrates and conflicted lover of Wagner’s music

{Setting: Symposium of Socrates}

I see Ellis has found a way to recycle his Punky Brewster spec script.  (By the way, he provides a link to a YouTube of Wagner’s Lohengrin as “suggested background music.”  It’s nice — lush and epic — but after reading the following dialogue, I would have gone with “Surfin’ Bird.”)

Socrates: We are gathered here today at my Symposium to discuss the venerated discipline of aesthetics and to seek to answer this question of the ages – Can immoral art be good? Or more pointedly, can an immoral person create good art?

Sir?  Can you please sign my drop slip?

Wimsatt & Beardsley: Yes, Socrates, philosophers call this paradox the intentional fallacy…

Socrates: Oh gee, thanks for explaining philosophy to me, guys.  Maybe you can stick around after class and give me a quick tutorial on togas and pederasty, too.

Wimsatt & Beardsley: …which developed in the New Criticism School of the 1930s and was first used by us in a 1946 essay. A long-running debate in philosophy has centered around the question of whether art that is morally bad can itself be good (as art).

…then we saw An American Carol, and just decided to go get shitfaced instead.

Leni Riefenstahl: The question of the intentional fallacy has tended to focus on controversial figures like Caravaggio, Van Gogh, Gauguin, Picasso, Andreas Serrano (“Pi– Christ” [1989]) or artists such as myself, for I was the German filmmaker for the Third Reich, the Nazi Party and for supreme chancellor of Germany, Adolf Hitler, whom I immortalized in such documentaries as “Triumph of the Will,” which chronicled the Nuremberg rallies, and “Olympia,” a documentary on the 1936 Berlin Olympics. I am profoundly ashamed of these movies now in light of Nazi atrocities and the human-rights genocide of the Holocaust, for my so-called art was exploited as Nazi propaganda. Nevertheless, many critics to this day consider my movies to be technically and artistically brilliant.

I had no idea playing with a Ouija board could be so dull.

Leni Riefenstahl: …but I have left the glorification of racial purity and fascist ideals behind me, and am currently developing a Porky’s-style teen comedy that I profoundly feel would be both morally and aesthetically good  for Zac Efron.

Socrates: To us, the ancient Greeks, the very idea of an intentional fallacy, the notion that one can separate art from beauty would have been readily dismissed, as for them the notions of beauty and moral goodness were inextricably linked –

Moreover, when I say “us” and “them,” I’m actually talking about “we.”  Remember, it’s philosophy, jackass, it’s supposed to be confusing!

–yet due largely to the modernist philosophy of relativism – the concept that points of view have no absolute truth or validity and have only relative, subjective values according to differences in perception and consideration – this question has proved more troublesome for the modern mind.

Socrates: But the verities of my time are as true today as they were in the 5th Century B.C.  Not only do the Ancient Greeks provide ethical guidance sufficient and appropriate to any conceivable dilemma, but us and them are also a good source of practical wisdom.  For instance, if you’re building an addition to your home — say, a new slave quarters — beware when you break ground for the foundation, for you may sever a subsurface gas or power line.  This can be avoided by praying to Tartarus, Erebos, or any other duly authorized chthonic god before you dig.

Much of modern art since 1900 isn’t about beauty, but has devolved into an unedifying mix of snobbishness, greed, grotesqueness and fetishism, which the intentional fallacy has only made worse. How?

Does it screw it up your Socratic method if I don’t feel like answering the question because I reject your bullshit premise?  If so, how?  And please show your work.

Because the New School Critics have legitimized the separation of God from art

Imagine how much more you would have enjoyed Too Close for Comfort had it been touched by the power of Zeus.

…goodness from beauty, art from truth, thus much of modern art has become an exaltation of evil, caricature, deception, politics and pride – rather than truth, virtue, beauty, realism and godliness.

As you may recall, Mr. Washington believes that Michael Savage is a Promethean figure, so if the pugnacious author and radio host is willing to recline on a rock for eternity while an eagle pecks at his liver, I think it would do much to reverse the trend toward snobbishness and greed by providing art that is not only morally good, but pretty damn entertaining.  Although it might make the grotesqueness and fetishism worse, especially if the Franklin Mint opts to immortalize the scene on a collectible plate.  Still, as Socrates himself would say, “Here, take a sip of this.  Does this taste funny to you?”

21 Responses to “The Socrapic Dialogues”

“Can an immoral person create good art?”
Define your terms, please.

By immoral, do you mean, like, a druggie or a drunkard? Like Mozart, Hank Williams, Jim Morrison, or Billie Holiday? Or someone who does bad things, like Roman Polanski or Phil Spector? Or maybe somebody who’s not evil but just flat out offensive, like Marilyn Manson or Frank Zappa.

By “good” art, do you sacred or moral, like the godawful (pun intended) “Christian Rock” I run into while scanning the dial on I-40? Or Pat Boone? Paintings of Jesus on black velvet, perhaps?

I don’t understand why a “mix of snobbishness, greed, grotesqueness and fetishism” in modern art is unedifying; really it’s just an accurate portrayal of where life is at these days. (Kenneth Lay had all four of those qualities going for him, and little else; look how far he got.) And why can’t art be good (as opposed to lousy)if it is all these things. The Stones’ “Sympathy for the Devil” paints a compelling portrait but isn’t inherently evil or Satanic, events at Altamont notwithstanding.

I guess I just don’t get the concept of intestinal phallus –er, intentional fallacy. Man is creative, because the universe is creative. All this good and evil stuff just gets old. Creativity as a force of nature doesn’t analyze things that way, any more than fire chooses what to burn. Are you going to dismiss the profoundly spiritual works of John Coltrane because he was a heroin addict?

As a turn of the century German philosopher/wacko named Rudolf Steiner said, if you want a crop of beautiful fragrant flowers, start off with a big pile of stinking shit.

“Jesus Christ, Ma, here’s another asshole who’s ninety-seven years late to the Sacre du Printemps riot.”

Wimsatt & Beardsley

I think he got them confused with Waldorf and Statler

I have to wonder if he has a pile of rejection letters for his Great American Novel, as Mr Washington writes in the tone of most failed wingnut “artists”, thinking their lack of acclaim was due to everything other than their own lack of talent.

Socrates
Richard Wagner, German Romantic composer
Leni Riefenstahl, Hitler’s filmmaker
Wimsatt & Beardsley, The New Criticism School
Ezra Pound, American expatriate poet
Publius, Pupil of Socrates and conflicted lover of Wagner’s music

Who infests Dantes Seventh Level?

I’ll have “Douchebags Name Dropped By Pretentious Asshats” for a thousand, Alex.

Or more pointedly, can an immoral person create good art?

“What is the sound of one hand fapping, Ellis?”

Because…”Socrates was not an epistemic or moral relativist. He pursued rational inquiry as a means of discovering the truth about ethical matters. But he did not advance any ethical doctrines or lay claim to any knowledge about ethical matters.”

Because the New School Critics have legitimized the separation of God from art

Seems to me that modren artists have IMMERSED God in art…(yes, I went there!)

Doghouse Riley for the win!

Is this tedious scold trying to put together another Entarte Kunst exhibition?

I normally dismiss the opinions of anyone who brings up “Piss Christ” as an example of much of anything, but in this case, when Mr Asked-And-Answered-Repeatedly has referenced “Pi– Christ”, I think I’ll have to dismiss with prejudice. Apparently “immoral” in Mr Washington’s world includes the actual use of the word “piss”, and if we have to start declaring artists without merit because they use words even seven year olds consider only mildly naughty, I think we need to just abandon the notion of civilization altogether.

“Yes Otto, but they don’t understand it.”

controversial figures like Caravaggio, Van Gogh, Gauguin, Picasso, Andreas Serrano (“Pi– Christ” [1989]) or artists such as myself, for I was the German filmmaker for the Third Reich

This guy really does live on a different planet. Given there are no laws covering interplanetary immigration, I’d suggest he be deported.

Why am I not surprised that Ellis Washington is a proponent of “critical race theory,” described by the Honorable Richard Posner (US Court of Appeals, the Seventh Circuit, Chicago) as the “lunatic core” of “radical legal egalitarianism.”

Hahahahaha!

Much of modern art since 1900 isn’t about beauty, but has devolved into an unedifying mix of snobbishness, greed, grotesqueness and fetishism, which the intentional fallacy has only made worse. How?

Aristole sez: “Petitio principii, asswipe!”

…Andreas Serrano (“Pi– Christ” [1989])

Pi Christ, the Three-point-one-four-one-five-nine-two-six-five-four In One.

Or did he mean to type “Pie Crust”?

As you may recall, Mr. Washington believes that Michael Savage is a Promethean figure,

I, too, believe that Michael Savage should be chained to a rock and each day have his liver torn out and devoured by an eagle.

I can’t believe no one mentioned this yet:

_veritas_ is Latin. Socrates, being Greek, would have been interested in _alitheia_.

Also, at first “Socrates” (in the essay) rejects the idea of the “intentional fallacy”; then he uses it to explain how it made art worse. I thought Socrates was supposed to be the sage voice of everlasting wisdom, who _knows_ that the intentional fallacy is itself not a fallacy.

Oh, Doghouse!!

Or maybe he got locked in the downstairs Gents at the Armory Show [1913, same as the Sacre, wow, some year for the forces of wicked] and has only now emerged.

Possibly as a result of 97 years’ exposure to toilet cleaning solvents, Ellis seems to have his ancients mixed up. What Socrates would have been doing with a Roman student named Publius (Wagner or no Wagner), I don’t know. But it’s not all down to Mr. Washington. I bow before your brilliance, Scott, but the toga wasn’t au fait in Periclean Athens. Togas were a mark of Roman citizenship (for men).

What did poor Van Gogh do that was so wrong? Just because he was friends with ladies of the evening? Maybe Prissy Washington doesn’t like sunflowers.

Maybe it was because Van Gogh committed suicide, which is often considered a mortal sin. Of course, it’s a dick movie to put him on the evil side because he succumbed to mental illness.

Carson: This is in your introducction to _Dorian Gray_: ‘There is no such thing as a moral or an immoral book. Books are well written, or badly written.’ That expresses your view?

Wilde: My view of art, yes.

Carson: Then, I take it, that no matter how immoral a book may be, if it is well written, it is, in your opinion, a good book?

Wilde: Yes. [...]

Carson: Then a well-written book putting forward sodomitical views may be a good book?

Wilde: No work of art ever puts forward views. Views belong to people who are not artists.

Carson: A sodomitical novel might be a good book?

Wilde: I don’t know what you mean by a sodomitical novel.

Carson: Then I will suggest _Dorian Gray_ as open to the impression of being such a novel?

Wilde: That could only be to brutes and illiterates.

Carson: An illiterate person reading _Dorian Gray_ might consider it such a novel?

Wilde: The views of illiterates on art are unaccountable. [...]

Carson: The majority of persons would come under your definition of Philistines and illiterates?

Wilde: I have found wonderful exceptions.

Regina (Oscar Wilde) vs. John Douglas (Marquess of Queensberry), 1895.

Well, I can think of just the art which would satisfy Mr Washington’s claim that art should be about “truth, virtue, beauty, realism and godliness.” It’s called “Socialist Realism.” Big hit with that paragon of virtue, Josef Stalin.

Only since 1900, Ellis is phoning it in, he needs to brush up on his Dies Commission transcripts. Rep. Starnes asked federal theater head Hallie Flanagan wasn’t it true that Christopher Marlowe was a card carrying communist. Upon being informed that he’d died in 1599, Starnes responded that we don’t know when “it” began and in any case playwrights have been untrustworthy, subversive reprobates going all the way back to Euripides. Now that’s a crackpot worthy of the name. Starnes was a wingnut’s wingnut before the concept existed.

According to I.F. Stone, Plutarch tells us that Socrates did not mind being lampooned in Aristophanes’ comedies, that when asked he replied “when they break a jest upon me in the theater, I feel as if I were at a big party of good friends”. I would expect Ellis would find Birds and Clouds to be grotesqueries, but Socrates apparently did not, so his idea of beauty, as well as morality, must have been quite different than that of Ellis.

My suggestion for Ellis would be to find more appropriate stalking horses for his philistinism.

Or maybe he got locked in the downstairs Gents at the Armory Show [1913, same as the Sacre, wow, some year for the forces of wicked] and has only now emerged.

Duchamp did say that the 20th century’s only contribution to art was criticism. It wasn’t meant as an indictment though, rather that the next logical step in creating art was to critique its commodification and role in society.

Similarly, there is the oft noted observation that in the late 19th C, vertically stacked, tertiary harmony had reached its ultimate expression, and could go no further, leaving music in a cul de sac. The next logical step was the criticism of the form itself. Composers then sought various ways out, looking to other cultures for melodic and harmonic material (Debussy), completely disregarding traditional notions of harmonic movement (Satie), granting equal weight to each pitch of the 12 note scale (Schoenberg, Webern, Berg), reaching back to folk cultures for rhythmic schemes that had been abandoned by western art music hundreds of years earlier (Stravinsky, Messiaen), pitting competing conventional tonalities against one another (Ives), the incorporation of blocks of sound and the detritus of the modern world (Varese, Antheil), etc.

All of which strike me as creative responses to the problem and not examples of greed, snobbishness nor fetishism.

I’m elated that my article, “Art, music and the Wagnerian dilemma,” provoked such passionate discussion. During this Holiday Season I wish you all …

Peace

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